I guess these are the type of people being referred to when I see the pieces by people living abroad saying, Don’t come! In response to Americans wanting to ditch post election. I find those essays super annoying but then we’ve been planning our move for years (bought a house last summer) and thinking about doing it the best ways we can. Studying French, etc.
I married a Frenchman and have lived in France for 54 years. It is a wonderful country and I feel fortunate to live here every day. But guess what? I made a huge effort to learn the language, the culture and the customs. The effort was well worth it. Oh and by the way I’m from Iowa ( that’s for the person who wrote a disparaging comment above).
This is the epitome of the obnoxious American who refuses to learn the language and then gets angry when they are misunderstood. She claims she did a ton of preparation before they moved here, but one would think she would’ve considered opening Duolingo once or twice
Its laughable this line of reasoning🤣 not learning the language and not wanting to hang with expats
Yes, it is hard making a late life move to another country, I did it with my husband at age 61…no, I still don’t speak French, (so stop F’ing asking), though I managed to get my A1 French language certificate, in fairly short order. I’m glad for Joanne’s honest, although painfully public journey. It is a good lesson for anyone considering a move to another country, whether France or other…if you really want to make it work, DO THE WORK.
That's a whole set of issues, I'd say it was more of an earlier term that referred to the British abroad during the days of Empire. It carries with it though the notion that the 'ex-pat' was simply out of the home country, the UK obvs, and had a right to be wherever they were rather than being an immigrant, because the territory was British. For some Brits this is so hard wired in that ex-pats in Spain voted for Brexit, effectively extinguishing their freedom of movement in Europe, because they simply didn't consider themselves immigrants! I know, scary stuff!
Thoughtful words in response to a person whose head was in the clouds. Feeling "at home" anywhere comes from making friends and, perhaps even more than learning the language, friendship is about reaching out to strangers and becoming a friend to them. I've only visited France (thus far) but have found the people as open as in the U.S. Mindset is the key.
About bureaucracy: Did you ever have to deal with healthcare in the US, or file taxes? The US even exports its bureaucracy in the form of FATCA, layering American bureaucracy on top of French private sector bureaucracy. And foreign earned income exclusion and other tax concepts … It’s not like you can escape American bureaucracy no matter where you go
I was fortunate in having had a good foundation in French from early childhood, but it’s not enough to have just the abilities of a five year old! I may a couple essays scheduled over the next couple months about ways of finding opportunities to connect with French speakers.
I’m an American who’s lived and worked in Germany for over 20 years, and when I first saw the news item back in November 2024, I found their attitude very hubristic.
For someone in their mid-70s to think that one can just “hunker down and learn French”, is as preposterous as being a being an art teacher your whole life and then suddenly declaring that you’re going to “hunker down and learn physics” and get a job at NASA. There’s a reason it’s called “native speaker” or “mother tongue” … it takes a lifetime to master. People in the States love the trope of the still-heavily-accented immigrant Italian restauranteur with-a-da Mario and-a-da Luigi-a accent, but never thought for a second about how it might feel one’s self to never be able to speak the language “properly”. I reached C1 level and still the first thing most Germans want to do when talking with me is switch to English … even if theirs is crappier than my German.
Also, no one’s going to get your pop culture references/analogies from ‘60s and ‘70s American TV. No one grew up reading your mainstream newspapers and magazines either, so expect to express yourself in less flowery terms … there’s a reason all those UN assemblies always sound so boring. And it’s not their job to cheerfully befriend foreigners any more than you felt compelled to do so yourself in the States. Many adult introductions and friendships revolve around a couple of decades of one’s own shared educational experiences, and then another couple of decades via one’s kids … that’s half a normal lifespan right there. You can’t parachute in at 75 and expect red carpets instantly rolled out any more than you were rolling them out back home.
Perhaps they moved to a too-small city to expect a Whole Foods produce experience. As stated in the article, Nîmes has 137,000 people; that's Lafayette Louisiana or Abiline Texas. It's in the deep south of France, and not quite on the Languedoc Coast, which in turn isn't exactly the Côte d'Azur; that's sort of like comparing Gulf Coast to the Atlantic Coast of Florida ... or the Jersey Shore to The Hamptons. Nîmes is farther away from Paris than Los Angeles is from San Francisco. They come across like New York mobsters relocated to the midwest in the Witness Protection Program who then endlessly complain that they can’t get a good bagel or slice of pizza.
Other countries have different safety and emissions standards for cars, and their own domestic car industries to protect and support, so no one makes it easy to import a US spec car (many of which don’t have amber indicators, foglights, Autobahn-grade running gear, etc. in the first place). Just try to import a modern European car that isn’t NHTSA-crash tested into the US … it’s met with an equal lack of enthusiasm.
I also don’t think European government agencies are necessarily more bureacratic than they are in the US, it’s just that they’re already busy enough to not be overjoyed when people not proficient in what’s often technical language rock up and expect service with a smile. Same for doctors and insurance companies; “oh, great, a couple of American oldsters … bet that’ll be a blast :-( “
Taxes are high because they’re investing in education and infrastructure for the next generation, and if you expect to be more luxuriously cared for in your dotage, well, you never really had any skin in the game societally, so why should they be overjoyed that some retired American couple wants to drop in, clip US Social Security coupons instead of having worked and made lifelong local insurance, social, and pension contributions, and then endlessly complain about the tax wedge? That’s exactly what cruise ships do, and why the locals increasingly want to keep them out.
Moving and living abroad is the ultimate luxury good. Expecting to do so on a Motel 6 budget and then complaining that it’s not The Ritz doesn’t elicit a lot of sympathy.
I feel your pain as a fellow C1 speaker. I keep laughing to myself about my languages “I’ve been studying the languages and living in-country most of my life! Why can’t I speak like a native yet?”. But I keep studying and reading and making inept conversation because I love the languages and their cultures and their people.
So well said my man, thank you. I did it 17 months ago, female, over 70 and alone....could not be happier (well except for the bureaucracy). My French is better each day and I have made some great French friends. I recently started seeing fellow Americans about 2 hours a week, that's all, it does help though. I am actually glad such people as those leaving choose not to stay, why give the rest of us a bad name. Just please hurry up and go back!
Very well done article. My husband and I considered moving to Strasbourg, just a train ride away from our son, but realized that inspite of my good French, he would be very isolated- learning French at 77 would be a daunting task, along with the hurdles for the bureaucracy. So back to long visits.
Smart lady. We began learning at 51 and 57. We took classes constantly and made forever French friends in our village of 200 in Southern Burgundy. We were amazed at how sweet and helpful our friends were. The most amazing experiences one could possibly have of living someplace for 20 years! I dream about it every night. Such as shame some French had to put up with the ugly American!
I kept up on the talk about this article, and am wondering, as you imply, if it could be a type of soft signal that mainstream media is veering away from the "things are better in Europe" narrative. After the NYT's sanewashing of Trump and the Washington's post refusal to endorse, I'm very suspicious of what I'm reading and what's behind it -- more than ever.
After living in France since 1978 with just a brief 15-month post-doctoral stint in the states in the late 1980s, I noticed that the US media seems to prefer reporting on France only when they can emphasize things that are not working well: massive strikes or protests, govt dysfunction, etc.
French laws and processes that protect the worker and favor unions are criticized if not openly laughed at ("get a load of this: there's a law in France that your boss can't contact you outside of office hours, hahaha that's so funny!" "The legal work hour weekly total was decreased to 35 hours, how do they get anything done?! Those crazy French people..." "Tipping is included in the restaurant check automatically, so bizarre!" Etc)
I may be a bit paranoid, but to me it looks like a concerted effort to convey that the European way of life is unworkable...heaven forbid that Americans begin to demand affordable health care, paid maternity leave, and at least 5 weeks paid vacation (in Germany & Scandinavia it's 6 weeks) - all of which are common in the majority of European countries. {End of rant} 😉
I've been in France for almost 22 years (Languedoc, Normandy and now Paris) and although there have been many, many moments (mainly related to bureaucracy) that I wanted to tear my hair out, I haven't regretted the move for one minute.
I learned the language to the point of passing the DELF B2 exam, we spent six weeks in Paris (pendant l’été) and made many other week-weeks long trips to Paris, Marseilles, Bourgogne, Normandie, and Provence over the last 10 years. We were certain that moving to Paris would be our “next chapter” so we are literally living here right now for a year while my youngest does his junior year of high school abroad. What I couldn’t have prepped for was the fact that Paris is cloudy and rainy and “gray” (voilà le “grisaille”) from October til April. I can handle the cold, but no sun? 😔 Also, I think the “terrible food” she was talking about is the food they stock in the big chain grocery stores like Monoprix and Franprix etc. There’s definitely an argument to be made on THAT “food.” Well…I could go on forever. Healthcare isn’t “free”, the French have interesting ways of dealing with things they find unjust like tattle tailing on you/each other like school kids on the playground. Very interesting observations since living here since September. Suffice to say, I’m glad we didn’t move our entire lives here just because we were die hard francophiles. Considering other regions of France (NOT Paris) and also, seriously considering the Carolinas back in the states. Ya never know where life will take you, but no regrets on the lessons learned and roads traveled!
I lived in Paris for a year and I can tell you with certainty that it is not indicative of life in other French cities and towns. It's like comparing NYC to Durham. And I remember that gray! Come south and enjoy the sun!
No Kidding!! (your response, not the lady who couldn't figure out a little change might be in order.)
Come on Joanne, my son has moved to France and I’m doing my best to learn the language!
I guess these are the type of people being referred to when I see the pieces by people living abroad saying, Don’t come! In response to Americans wanting to ditch post election. I find those essays super annoying but then we’ve been planning our move for years (bought a house last summer) and thinking about doing it the best ways we can. Studying French, etc.
It seems to me that this woman epitomizes the Ugly American !!!
europeans are raised to be more private than americans. Joanne should move to Iowa.
I married a Frenchman and have lived in France for 54 years. It is a wonderful country and I feel fortunate to live here every day. But guess what? I made a huge effort to learn the language, the culture and the customs. The effort was well worth it. Oh and by the way I’m from Iowa ( that’s for the person who wrote a disparaging comment above).
This is the epitome of the obnoxious American who refuses to learn the language and then gets angry when they are misunderstood. She claims she did a ton of preparation before they moved here, but one would think she would’ve considered opening Duolingo once or twice
Its laughable this line of reasoning🤣 not learning the language and not wanting to hang with expats
Yes, it is hard making a late life move to another country, I did it with my husband at age 61…no, I still don’t speak French, (so stop F’ing asking), though I managed to get my A1 French language certificate, in fairly short order. I’m glad for Joanne’s honest, although painfully public journey. It is a good lesson for anyone considering a move to another country, whether France or other…if you really want to make it work, DO THE WORK.
Bon journey Joanne!
BTW…don’t be a Joanne. 😘
Super interesting and refreshing post! Thanks for the thought that went into writing this.
I have a British friend who suggests the term ex-Pat was adopted by the British to somehow smugly avoid referring to themselves as immigrants.
That's a whole set of issues, I'd say it was more of an earlier term that referred to the British abroad during the days of Empire. It carries with it though the notion that the 'ex-pat' was simply out of the home country, the UK obvs, and had a right to be wherever they were rather than being an immigrant, because the territory was British. For some Brits this is so hard wired in that ex-pats in Spain voted for Brexit, effectively extinguishing their freedom of movement in Europe, because they simply didn't consider themselves immigrants! I know, scary stuff!
Thoughtful words in response to a person whose head was in the clouds. Feeling "at home" anywhere comes from making friends and, perhaps even more than learning the language, friendship is about reaching out to strangers and becoming a friend to them. I've only visited France (thus far) but have found the people as open as in the U.S. Mindset is the key.
About bureaucracy: Did you ever have to deal with healthcare in the US, or file taxes? The US even exports its bureaucracy in the form of FATCA, layering American bureaucracy on top of French private sector bureaucracy. And foreign earned income exclusion and other tax concepts … It’s not like you can escape American bureaucracy no matter where you go
Agree. The US system is no picnic. The challenges in the French system for us include speaking a new language and learning new protocols.
I was fortunate in having had a good foundation in French from early childhood, but it’s not enough to have just the abilities of a five year old! I may a couple essays scheduled over the next couple months about ways of finding opportunities to connect with French speakers.
I’m an American who’s lived and worked in Germany for over 20 years, and when I first saw the news item back in November 2024, I found their attitude very hubristic.
For someone in their mid-70s to think that one can just “hunker down and learn French”, is as preposterous as being a being an art teacher your whole life and then suddenly declaring that you’re going to “hunker down and learn physics” and get a job at NASA. There’s a reason it’s called “native speaker” or “mother tongue” … it takes a lifetime to master. People in the States love the trope of the still-heavily-accented immigrant Italian restauranteur with-a-da Mario and-a-da Luigi-a accent, but never thought for a second about how it might feel one’s self to never be able to speak the language “properly”. I reached C1 level and still the first thing most Germans want to do when talking with me is switch to English … even if theirs is crappier than my German.
Also, no one’s going to get your pop culture references/analogies from ‘60s and ‘70s American TV. No one grew up reading your mainstream newspapers and magazines either, so expect to express yourself in less flowery terms … there’s a reason all those UN assemblies always sound so boring. And it’s not their job to cheerfully befriend foreigners any more than you felt compelled to do so yourself in the States. Many adult introductions and friendships revolve around a couple of decades of one’s own shared educational experiences, and then another couple of decades via one’s kids … that’s half a normal lifespan right there. You can’t parachute in at 75 and expect red carpets instantly rolled out any more than you were rolling them out back home.
Perhaps they moved to a too-small city to expect a Whole Foods produce experience. As stated in the article, Nîmes has 137,000 people; that's Lafayette Louisiana or Abiline Texas. It's in the deep south of France, and not quite on the Languedoc Coast, which in turn isn't exactly the Côte d'Azur; that's sort of like comparing Gulf Coast to the Atlantic Coast of Florida ... or the Jersey Shore to The Hamptons. Nîmes is farther away from Paris than Los Angeles is from San Francisco. They come across like New York mobsters relocated to the midwest in the Witness Protection Program who then endlessly complain that they can’t get a good bagel or slice of pizza.
Other countries have different safety and emissions standards for cars, and their own domestic car industries to protect and support, so no one makes it easy to import a US spec car (many of which don’t have amber indicators, foglights, Autobahn-grade running gear, etc. in the first place). Just try to import a modern European car that isn’t NHTSA-crash tested into the US … it’s met with an equal lack of enthusiasm.
I also don’t think European government agencies are necessarily more bureacratic than they are in the US, it’s just that they’re already busy enough to not be overjoyed when people not proficient in what’s often technical language rock up and expect service with a smile. Same for doctors and insurance companies; “oh, great, a couple of American oldsters … bet that’ll be a blast :-( “
Taxes are high because they’re investing in education and infrastructure for the next generation, and if you expect to be more luxuriously cared for in your dotage, well, you never really had any skin in the game societally, so why should they be overjoyed that some retired American couple wants to drop in, clip US Social Security coupons instead of having worked and made lifelong local insurance, social, and pension contributions, and then endlessly complain about the tax wedge? That’s exactly what cruise ships do, and why the locals increasingly want to keep them out.
Moving and living abroad is the ultimate luxury good. Expecting to do so on a Motel 6 budget and then complaining that it’s not The Ritz doesn’t elicit a lot of sympathy.
I feel your pain as a fellow C1 speaker. I keep laughing to myself about my languages “I’ve been studying the languages and living in-country most of my life! Why can’t I speak like a native yet?”. But I keep studying and reading and making inept conversation because I love the languages and their cultures and their people.
So well said my man, thank you. I did it 17 months ago, female, over 70 and alone....could not be happier (well except for the bureaucracy). My French is better each day and I have made some great French friends. I recently started seeing fellow Americans about 2 hours a week, that's all, it does help though. I am actually glad such people as those leaving choose not to stay, why give the rest of us a bad name. Just please hurry up and go back!
Very well done article. My husband and I considered moving to Strasbourg, just a train ride away from our son, but realized that inspite of my good French, he would be very isolated- learning French at 77 would be a daunting task, along with the hurdles for the bureaucracy. So back to long visits.
Smart lady. We began learning at 51 and 57. We took classes constantly and made forever French friends in our village of 200 in Southern Burgundy. We were amazed at how sweet and helpful our friends were. The most amazing experiences one could possibly have of living someplace for 20 years! I dream about it every night. Such as shame some French had to put up with the ugly American!
I kept up on the talk about this article, and am wondering, as you imply, if it could be a type of soft signal that mainstream media is veering away from the "things are better in Europe" narrative. After the NYT's sanewashing of Trump and the Washington's post refusal to endorse, I'm very suspicious of what I'm reading and what's behind it -- more than ever.
I agree with you on that, Betty.
After living in France since 1978 with just a brief 15-month post-doctoral stint in the states in the late 1980s, I noticed that the US media seems to prefer reporting on France only when they can emphasize things that are not working well: massive strikes or protests, govt dysfunction, etc.
French laws and processes that protect the worker and favor unions are criticized if not openly laughed at ("get a load of this: there's a law in France that your boss can't contact you outside of office hours, hahaha that's so funny!" "The legal work hour weekly total was decreased to 35 hours, how do they get anything done?! Those crazy French people..." "Tipping is included in the restaurant check automatically, so bizarre!" Etc)
I may be a bit paranoid, but to me it looks like a concerted effort to convey that the European way of life is unworkable...heaven forbid that Americans begin to demand affordable health care, paid maternity leave, and at least 5 weeks paid vacation (in Germany & Scandinavia it's 6 weeks) - all of which are common in the majority of European countries. {End of rant} 😉
I totally agree…and get ready to see life here portrayed even more negatively. I am never, ever, moving back to the USA.
I've been in France for almost 22 years (Languedoc, Normandy and now Paris) and although there have been many, many moments (mainly related to bureaucracy) that I wanted to tear my hair out, I haven't regretted the move for one minute.
Not to mention your expertise in the wide world of French cheese!
I learned the language to the point of passing the DELF B2 exam, we spent six weeks in Paris (pendant l’été) and made many other week-weeks long trips to Paris, Marseilles, Bourgogne, Normandie, and Provence over the last 10 years. We were certain that moving to Paris would be our “next chapter” so we are literally living here right now for a year while my youngest does his junior year of high school abroad. What I couldn’t have prepped for was the fact that Paris is cloudy and rainy and “gray” (voilà le “grisaille”) from October til April. I can handle the cold, but no sun? 😔 Also, I think the “terrible food” she was talking about is the food they stock in the big chain grocery stores like Monoprix and Franprix etc. There’s definitely an argument to be made on THAT “food.” Well…I could go on forever. Healthcare isn’t “free”, the French have interesting ways of dealing with things they find unjust like tattle tailing on you/each other like school kids on the playground. Very interesting observations since living here since September. Suffice to say, I’m glad we didn’t move our entire lives here just because we were die hard francophiles. Considering other regions of France (NOT Paris) and also, seriously considering the Carolinas back in the states. Ya never know where life will take you, but no regrets on the lessons learned and roads traveled!
I lived in Paris for a year and I can tell you with certainty that it is not indicative of life in other French cities and towns. It's like comparing NYC to Durham. And I remember that gray! Come south and enjoy the sun!
I’m feeling swayed Roberto and Carolyn. And hopeful. 😘